Author Topic: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.  (Read 1944 times)

Offline PAULRIDES

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Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« on: March 22, 2012, 09:13:11 pm »
Not trying to be an instructor -- but maybe this will help someone sometime. Take it for what it is worth, I am not into arguing about it (cause we are all X-PERTS).  :groan

There is braking before a curve (best idea to get the right speed before entering a curve).  ;D

HOWEVER,  sometimes we misjudge, curves tighten up, obstacles show up, etc. So, braking in a turn is required:: The preferred way straighten up and brake normally with both brakes cannot be used because not enough room, etc. So, the other method is to slow (bleed sped) while in the curve as in when leaned over.

Or, as I did the other day in a reasonable easy right hand turn which became a problem for me that I will largely blame on 'Lack of attention to my riding." - I ended up wide and in Panic Mode. I did NOT brake, and BARELY had sense enough to just MAKE THE CURVE (which most of us not pushing the limit can easily do - bikes will lean and turn a lot more than most of us average street riders push them or at least a lot more than I push it).  Just ask the Knee Draggers.

Anyway, I barely made it lean over to complete the curve before running off the road (I was maybe 3 or 2 feet from the edge). SAD and RIDUCULOUS (not like I just started riding yesterday and never did a curve before).

By the way, it was not a case of speeding, or a extra bad curve that got sharp, it was just an average curve --and I say again "I was not paying attention or something, sometimes we just get complacent."  Paul

THE FOLLOWING ARTICLE was sent to me by a ride friend, TerrM, who is a Motorcycle Safety Course instructor (to the level of expert and advanced). I asked him to send me all articles he sends to his Goldwing Chapter. 

This month?s column is, once again, on braking in a turn when you have misjudged your entry speed.

I received a call from Van on my talk from last month on using the front brake in a turn.  He had always learned (and he is right) the best way to brake in a turn is to straighten the handlebars, let the bike stand up then get firmly hard on both brakes.   In case you were rusty, the steps on this procedure:  Square the handlebars (move your head to look forward and press the outside handlebar to square).  Apply both brakes with appropriate speed of application.  As weight shifts to the front wheel, consider easing off the rear brake.  If the rear brake should lock up, procedure is to keep it locked until at a stop.
   
This method works when you are aware of the problem in time, but sometimes there just isn?t enough room due to narrow roadway, someone on your side of the road, debris on the road; all of which mean you were late to spot the threat.

One positive consideration for Gold Wing riders is that there is more weight over the rear wheel than in most other type motorcycles (heavy machine, often ridden two up, loaded with gear) giving them more traction, but much of that weight still transfers forward with brake application.

Clearly, the best time to scrub off speed is before you enter the turn, but if you have misjudged?  Well, what do the Pro?s do?  They use both brakes!  But they make a very big deal out of the fact that they must practice with it almost daily as it is such a sensitive touch. 

?Sport Riding Techniques? by Nick Ienatsch is the main text for MSF?s Advanced Rider Course Instructor Course.  Van?s questions brought me back to this book.  There are ten pages devoted to turning (Note: I think he means braking) in a curve.  It is hard to get all the salient facts in a one page article, so I will lend the book to you should you care to get more into this.  In the meantime?

You find yourself in a curve where there just isn?t enough room to straighten first due to narrow roadway, someone on your side of the road, debris on the road, anything requiring slowing to modify your path of travel.  You need to slow NOW! 

Apply the front with two fingers closing steadily, smoothly, never grabbing.  As the motorcycle begins to slow and straighten, apply some rear brake. 

Whew!  All those hundreds of times you have practiced this procedure have paid off.  If you make it thousands of times, you may be in the zone to use the rear brake more in that situation. Reading and rereading Ienatsch?s text, I find that he likes the rear brake for many reasons, but it takes much finesse.

In one paragraph, he wrote of a riding test he formulated for a group of seasoned riders.  Those who practiced braking in a curve rode only once a week at the speeds they normally rode found themselves overwhelmed by their own lack of skill.  He suggests daily practice in order to achieve proper application of the rear brake.  Braking hard in a turn may or may not be an emergency procedure, but it is a skill to be practiced. 

Remember, the greatest motorcyclist is not the one whose skill at braking and swerving can get him out of any situation, but rather he whose situational awareness keep him from getting into that situation to begin with.

And, oh yeah, you?re not as good as you once were, and you were never as good as you thought you were.       
Ride Country Roads - a lot. :-)

Offline Curtie223

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Re: Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2012, 06:39:22 am »
Love the read. Its always good to have some info out there to help new and seasoned riders!

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Offline PAULRIDES

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Re: Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2012, 07:58:18 am »
Love the read. Its always good to have some info out there to help new and seasoned riders!

Yes. What do you think about my "near screw up".

Am I getting to old to ride? Do not say YES.  :33

Did you ever do similar or have that feeling of being pulled off the road? Please, do say YES as it will make me feel better about myself.  ;D
« Last Edit: March 30, 2012, 02:19:49 pm by PAULRIDES »
Ride Country Roads - a lot. :-)

Offline Curtie223

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Re: Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2012, 08:50:26 am »
Oh yeah, generally the same reason. Not paying attention to where I was going sue to looking around. Haha I think anyone that says they haven't messed up while riding isn't telling the truth. We all go brain numb from time to time. :34

 2001 KTM 300exc 
 2004 LTZ400



-When you see another rider keep in mind that is another friend you haven't had the chance to meet yet!!
-Riding is about doing what you love! No matter what you ride or how you ride. Just as long as you

Offline Marid2apterbilt

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Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2012, 11:08:58 pm »
Oh yeah, generally the same reason. Not paying attention to where I was going sue to looking around. Haha I think anyone that says they haven't messed up while riding isn't telling the truth. We all go brain numb from time to time. :34

+1

Im no expert either but will add...

Do not be afraid to use the front brakes while even at full lean.  You just have to be smooth n light on them as stated w/ 2 fingers usually.  In time n practice you will find out just how much BRAKE you can apply. 

Most bikes depending on the rpm, gear, motor size, Rolling off the throttle even with a knee on the ground is like applying the rear brake and will make the bike slide out a bit.

Every bike, rider, is a bit different w/ other variables so it also depends on you and your setup how the bike will react everytime.

I have found the best thing for mid corner ooh **** is first BELIVE and tell yourself to TURN.  If that fails, Get on the brakes as best you can before leaving the asphalt and if you have run off room (grass) Stay off the Fronts, get off the gas, Dirt bike that baby w/ the rear brake as it tank slaps and you slow to a more manageable speed ( I was doing 110 mph  :34
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Offline PAULRIDES

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Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2012, 12:35:06 pm »
I have found the best thing for mid corner ooh crap is first BELIVE and tell yourself to TURN.  [/quote]

You hit the nail on the head. That should have been the KEY PROCEDURE for me on my screw up ---  and in most all cases for me cause I am not anywhere near the limit of what the bike would lean or curve at anytime.

I do ride and enjoy a litttle lean, etc.  ;D  -- but, not near the limit. So, just make it TURN would be the thing. Sometimes easier said than done ---It was like a panic, being drawn off the road, fixed on the road edge instead of the turn, can't make it turn --- all that combined, I guess.  ???

One thing for sure -- it felt like crap and was an eye opening wake up, I HOPE.  :o   
Ride Country Roads - a lot. :-)

Offline Marid2apterbilt

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Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2012, 04:09:59 pm »
When that happens its a SR. Survival reaxtion and u must learn to over come them. Your brain says ooh **** n your arms kinda lock up till u convince the brain its ok, more lean is OK. Or just tell yourself. Lowside is OK. Head first into tree BAD.
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Fine dont eat my CUPCAKES then

Just because your a Touron doesnt mean we Locals should kiss your......

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Offline PAULRIDES

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Re: Braking and Curves - before a curve and in a curve.
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2012, 07:55:59 pm »
Or just tell yourself. Lowside is OK. Head first into tree BAD.
[/quote]

FOR SURE.  8)
Ride Country Roads - a lot. :-)