Author Topic: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!  (Read 3684 times)

Offline Chris

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Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« on: November 19, 2015, 03:24:25 am »
Once a dominant force in the sportbike genre Suzuki has been largely dormant for several years.  It looks like they've decided to try to reclaim their crown.  The bike looks superb but I wonder at the decision to leave out inertial sensors.  Can you build a top flight sport bike without the increasingly sophisticated rider aids we've come to expect from the other manufacturers such as BMW?  I guess we'll see when the new Gixxer has to earn its keep up against the others.

Here's two reports about the new uber-Gixxer introduced at the recent 2015 EICMA Show in Milan.

Chris


First Article:

Seen at the Brit Visordown websitehttp://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-new-bikes/finally---suzukis-new-gsxr-1000/28463.html

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Finally - Suzuki's new GSXR-1000!
Suzuki is back!
 
 
Posted: 17 November 2015
by Visordown News







IT'S been a long time coming but at last it's here. This is the new Suzuki GSX-R1000.
It's been unveiled at the Eicma Milan motorcycle show as a 'prototype' but it's an open secret that this is to be launched in the second half of next year as a 2017 model.

Full specifications have not been released but Suzuki says it's the 'most powerful, hardest-accelerating, cleanest-running GSX-R ever built,' as well as the most compact, aerodynamic and best-handling.

It's new from the ground up according to Suzuki, with an all-new 999cc in-line-four engine and aluminium frame. The firm makes no bones about the goal: 'To regain the king of sports bikes crown' from the likes of Yamaha's R1 and Ducati's 1299 Panigale.

It's got 10-level traction control, three power modes, a ride-by-wire throttle with a claimed smoother response, a quick-shifter, launch control and of course ABS. Like Ducati's 1299 Panigale S, the quick-shifter allows clutchless upshifts and downshifts, with no need to blip the throttle. The launch control system automatically limits engine speed and torque delivery while the rider holds the throttle wide open and releases the clutch.

Suzuki says the rider aids package 'doesn’t require a degree in engineering to understand and doesn’t need constant adjustment by a squad of computer technicians to work'.

Good.

The new engine uses variable valve timing to deliver a claimed increase in top-end with no loss in bottom-end or mid-range. It's also got secondary injectors in the top of the air box that operate at high rpm, plus servo-operated butterfly valves in the exhaust which open at high rpm.

It's got a Showa 'Balance Free' fork and shock which Suzuki says were developed for racing and offer more consistent damping. The shock is claimed to be lighter than the old one.

The bodywork is described as MotoGP-inspired, and more aerodynamic and compact than the existing model, for better handling and top speed. A new fuel tank has a 'lower top and a sleeker shape' to help the rider tuck behind the screen. The new GSX-R1000 has got LED indicators and lights front and rear.

Price will presumably be revealed ones Suzuki officially decides to sell it. 

************************* end of article ********************************

Second Article:

Seen at the Gizmag.com website: http://www.gizmag.com/suzuki-gsx-r1000-eicma-l7/40466/

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Suzuki announces all-new GSX-R1000 superbike at EICMA 2015
•    LOZ BLAIN
•    NOVEMBER 17, 2015







Devastated by the financial crisis of 2008, Suzuki has been forced to sit by and watch as its rivals dominate the superbike class. But now the plucky Japanese company is ready to step back on the dance floor and boogie with a brand new GSX-R1000, built from the ground up to put the Big Gixxer back in contention at the pointy end of the sportsbike market. Featuring a mechanical variable valve timing system, Suzuki is aiming to engineer the L7 GSX-R so well it doesn't need top-shelf electronics like an Inertial Measurement Unit to compete.

Last time Suzuki did a ground-up redesign of its flagship GSX-R1000 back in 2005, it broke the superbike class right open. There was no question, the K5 Gixxer Thou' was the baddest big-bore bitumen scalpel money could buy. I remember flipping through the magazine reviews slack-jawed in wonder. My favourite image of the bike looked a lot like this one:

The copy said something like "we've just laid out the bits we changed," thus throwing down the challenge to see if you could think of a single bit that was missing from the picture. It was all very droll, but it got the message across: this was revolution, not evolution.

The K5 Gixxer, from which the current model was developed, still stands proud as a truly awesome bike, but times have moved on as they must, and Suzuki's current GSX-R really can't swing with today's exotic heavyweights. All the European brands have something on the showroom floor that punches harder, and with more finesse. Yamaha added fuel to the fire at last year's EICMA show with its first 200-horsepower R1, dripping with MotoGP bits and pieces. A new GSX-R is long overdue.

And here it is – a concept version, anyway. The GSX-R1000 L7 will be a 2017 model with (we assume) a mid-2016 release date. And like the K5, it's been redesigned from scratch.



Suzuki says the L7 will be the lightest, the most powerful, the most compact, the hardest accelerating and the cleanest-running Gixxer ever to roll. The company makes no bones about its ambition: it wants to take back its "proper title of the King of Sportsbikes."



To do so, it's going to need to get up and over the 200-horsepower mark, but Suzuki is making sure the new Gixxer hits hard down low as well. The L7 will be the first bike in the superbike class to feature variable valve timing. The VVT system will use steel balls in grooves in the intake cam sprockets that are moved outward by centrifugal force as the revs come up to retard the intake cam timing at high rpm. Thus, cam timing is optimized differently for low and high rpm, giving strong low-end torque but adding to the top-end rush. Peak rpm, and thus top-end power is also higher thanks to a low-mass finger follower valve train.



Electronics-wise, the Gixxer will get three drive modes that change throttle response and fuel mapping. There's a 10-stage traction control system, an up/down quickshifter and full-throttle launch control for traffic light supremacy – and race starts, yeah, race starts.
The lack of an Inertial Measurement Unit comes as a bit of a surprise. Without one, the GSX-R won't be able to run lean angle-sensitive ABS or drive a clever semi-active suspension option like the BMW S1000RR's down the track. Suzuki believes it'll get the fundamentals so right that the bike won't need one, and that's got to be good news for the retail price.
Suspension-wise it'll wear the latest good bits from Showa, namely Balance Free Front (BFF) forks with external damping circuits and a Balance Free Rear Cushion (BFRC) shock, and street riders will appreciate Suzuki's first LED headlight. We'll hear more about the bike's final spec as it enters production.

I sure don't envy the product team on a job like this. Today's top-end superbikes are so darn fast, and so darn full of expensive bits and pieces that you've got to spend a ton of money to be in the hunt. Suzuki believes it can engineer its way back to the top rather than getting there with expensive electronics, producing a bike "that doesn't require a degree in engineering to understand, and doesn't need constant adjustment by a squad of computer technicians to work."



It's a bold statement in this electronic age, but one that's bound to resonate with a lot of riders. Let's see how it fares when the chips are down, and let's see how much longer Honda holds out with its ageing Fireblade design!



************************* end of article ********************************
« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 03:28:11 am by Chris »
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2015, 05:51:30 am »
I. Like their traditionalist approach.

But i dont like the "by wire" on anything.

But i an old school kind of guy.
What does "riding season" mean?

Offline Luvmystar

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2015, 07:55:22 am »
 :21 I agree with Rick.
Marc

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Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2015, 10:02:05 am »
Maybe the goal is to keep the price well below competitors? Glad to see Suzuki finally seems to have recovered from the tsunamai & money crunch. Looking forward to seeing what else they have in the works.
1978 Suzuki GS1000EC - Completely custom.
2012 Triumph Daytona 675R

Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2015, 12:53:18 pm »
I. Like their traditionalist approach.

But i dont like the "by wire" on anything.

But i an old school kind of guy.

Perhaps it's due to my aircraft avionics background but "fly-by-wire" systems strike me as much more reliable and trouble free than cable operated anything.  Consider: bowden cables require adjustment and lubrication, are prone to breaking,and are much heavier than a wire and require careful routing to work properly.  An electrical system is lighter even if the designers go with redundancies to ensure reliability, doesn't need adjustment or periodic maintenance, and is largely indifferent to how it's routed.  Should there be a problem, it's a lot easier to replace/repair a wire than a bowden cable.   Further, now that all new bikes use EFI, your throttle grip is basically communicating to a computer...why not make it a direct connection?

I'm very old school myself but "fly-by-wire" systems have been on production aircraft for about 40 years.

I'd be more leery of the Variable Valve Timing (VVT) Suzuki has incorporated in this bike.  I'm sure it works but I'd have questions about its maintenance and longevity.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 12:54:25 pm by Chris »
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2015, 01:33:37 pm »

I'd be more leery of the Variable Valve Timing (VVT) Suzuki has incorporated in this bike.  I'm sure it works but I'd have questions about its maintenance and longevity.

That doesn't concern me much. It's been in use on automotive engines for decades. I know Honda has used their VTEC on some of their motorcycles (VFR800 for instance). Kawasaki uses it to compensate for the sluggish bottom end on the Concours 14.  Suzuki's use of a mechanical VVT is more interesting to me than anything else. I'm actually surprised it isn't used more in motorcycles. After a quick search it looks like that is changing. Ducati also has DVT (Desmodromic Valve Timing) in the works. http://ducati.com/en/testastretta_DVT/index.do#tech
1978 Suzuki GS1000EC - Completely custom.
2012 Triumph Daytona 675R

Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2015, 01:40:47 pm »
That doesn't concern me much. It's been in use on automotive engines for decades. I know Honda has used their VTEC on some of their motorcycles (VFR800 for instance). Kawasaki uses it to compensate for the sluggish bottom end on the Concours 14.  Suzuki's use of a mechanical VVT is more interesting to me than anything else. I'm actually surprised it isn't used more in motorcycles. After a quick search it looks like that is changing. Ducati also has DVT (Desmodromic Valve Timing) in the works. http://ducati.com/en/testastretta_DVT/index.do#tech

I noticed that one write up noted something special about Suzuki's system:  "The VVT system will use steel balls..."

Hmmm...that's something every sportsbike rider needs, steel balls!    :)

But those steel balls brought to mind my many, many sessions replacing the CV joints on VW busses when those balls wore out.  The job wasn't too hard but happened often enough to be a pain.  To avoid that pain, hoping the darn things would last, meant periodically repacking them with the special moly CV grease and checking the rubber boots religiously.  Hence my concern with longevity and special maintenance needs with Suzuki's mechanical  VVT.

After all, I don't want to end worrying more about the well being of the bike's balls than mine.

« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 02:02:58 pm by Chris »
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2015, 02:39:52 pm »
I noticed that one write up noted something special about Suzuki's system:  "The VVT system will use steel balls..."

Hmmm...something every sportsbike rider needs, right?

I'm interested to see how that works. Honda's VTEC system seems to me to be the easiest and most reliable system that I know of to date. Not sure if it's patents that keep people from using a similar design or if there is an advantage to doing it differently. I thought about how best to explain the Honda system but we'll start with this:

The cams have extra lobes that during normal operation are unused, at a time determined by the computer based on several variables an electric actuator engages and locks the rocker arms together forcing them to use the extra (taller) cam lobe. I don't have any experience working on VVT motorcycle engines but in my automotive experience the only failure I've ever seen with the VTEC system is the solenoid failing. If it fails, the engine just continues on as normal and lacks the VVT feature. It's a cheap and quick repair. Obviously other peoples systems will differ.
I guess I should note that this could be considered a mechanical system as the actual engagement of the VVT is mechanical though the rest of the system is computer driven. I wonder if this is what Suzuki means by mechanical? There have been purely mechanical VVT systems in the past (experiments as early as 1910 in aircraft and the 1920's for automotive) but computers make it a much more adaptable system.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2015, 02:41:43 pm by IanC »
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Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2015, 03:32:18 pm »
I'm interested to see how that works. Honda's VTEC system seems to me to be the easiest and most reliable system that I know of to date. Not sure if it's patents that keep people from using a similar design or if there is an advantage to doing it differently. I thought about how best to explain the Honda system but we'll start with this:

The cams have extra lobes that during normal operation are unused, at a time determined by the computer based on several variables an electric actuator engages and locks the rocker arms together forcing them to use the extra (taller) cam lobe. I don't have any experience working on VVT motorcycle engines but in my automotive experience the only failure I've ever seen with the VTEC system is the solenoid failing. If it fails, the engine just continues on as normal and lacks the VVT feature. It's a cheap and quick repair. Obviously other peoples systems will differ.
I guess I should note that this could be considered a mechanical system as the actual engagement of the VVT is mechanical though the rest of the system is computer driven. I wonder if this is what Suzuki means by mechanical? There have been purely mechanical VVT systems in the past (experiments as early as 1910 in aircraft and the 1920's for automotive) but computers make it a much more adaptable system.

The Gizmag report said:  "The VVT system will use steel balls in grooves in the intake cam sprockets that are moved outward by centrifugal force as the revs come up to retard the intake cam timing at high rpm. Thus, cam timing is optimized differently for low and high rpm, giving strong low-end torque but adding to the top-end rush."

So, the Honda system actually changes to a different cam profile at different engine speeds but the Suzuki system keeps using the same cam lobes but advances or retards the cam much like an old centrifugal advance ignition distributor to get more optimal cam timing at different engine RPMs.  I seem to remember that's how the Ducati DVT system changes the cam timing too but I think it's computer controlled rather than mechanically as the Suzuki seems to be..
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2015, 03:44:38 pm »
Ah, I missed that part. So you're right, sounds exactly like a mechanical ignition advance. Interesting idea. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I'd say that should eliminate any reliability issues as it's pretty much self contained but I like the idea of a computer adjusting engagement based on conditions.
1978 Suzuki GS1000EC - Completely custom.
2012 Triumph Daytona 675R

Offline PAULRIDES

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2015, 09:07:09 pm »
Interesting stuff.

Guess it does not really affect and old "I Just Ride Guy" as far as performance is concerned. I can hardly handle 500 cc of power.  :happyrider   :groan
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Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2015, 01:27:41 pm »
Well. . .

This is quite an educational thread..

Any way. . . .

I dont doubt that the "by wire" tech is sufficient for the challenge.

I just prefer the feedback of mechanicsl linkage.

Guess thats why i prefer old bikes.

With that said

All these electronic devices that control so much of the driveline just seem like more opportunities for failure.

Hell, i prefer points distributors in my hot rods.

Dual point, preferably.

But like i said, im old school.
What does "riding season" mean?

Offline Luvmystar

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2015, 08:06:48 pm »
Got 2 drive by wire trucks in the family stable and not impressed with either.Like Rick I just like the feel better.Does my preference have anything do with performance.No.I realize all this stuff does improve performance but for me looking down the rode in ownership I see parts that easily become obsolete that there is no way to work around.I know those parts exist on most everything but they are entering an area that I fear would be more apt to happen.The percent of those is parts on a vehicle is too great.One of the reasons for my stubborness in just riding my bike is I absolutely hate new cars and all that stuff.I like for something to be able to be fixed with some common sense and elbow grease and be fun to drive.Sorry for being longwinded just want explain my reasons behind my feelings.
Marc

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Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2015, 04:42:09 am »
This youtube video about the new Gixxer thou showed up in my email this morning.

Thank you Suzuki.  If I couldn't ride a Suzuki today at least I could watch one after shoveling the snow off my driveway and sidewalk.


 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hS325Iqop4&feature=youtu.be
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 04:43:12 am by Chris »
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2015, 05:51:47 am »
This youtube video about the new Gixxer thou showed up in my email this morning.

Thank you Suzuki.  If I couldn't ride a Suzuki today at least I could watch one after shoveling the snow off my driveway and sidewalk.


 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hS325Iqop4&feature=youtu.be

27 degrees this morning.

First day riding the venture to work.

Go ride man!
What does "riding season" mean?

Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2015, 09:11:36 am »
27 degrees this morning.

First day riding the venture to work.

Go ride man!

It was a bit chilly riding in this morning but then we didn't have snow/ice to worry about yet.
1978 Suzuki GS1000EC - Completely custom.
2012 Triumph Daytona 675R

Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2015, 05:57:36 pm »
It was a bit chilly riding in this morning but then we didn't have snow/ice to worry about yet.

Yup.

Learned how well my new gloves worked this morning.

Found them sadly lacking.

Oh well, wear 'em anyway.

It was a bit chilly at 6:15 in the a.m. though.

What does "riding season" mean?

Offline IanC

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2015, 06:34:14 pm »
Yup.

Learned how well my new gloves worked this morning.

Found them sadly lacking.

Oh well, wear 'em anyway.

It was a bit chilly at 6:15 in the a.m. though.

I use these snow mobile gloves from Fly Racing. http://www.flyracing.com/product/snow/outerwear/gloves/aurora-glove/724/black On really cold mornings I use some Freez-out liners from CycleGear. You can find those Fly gloves on ebay for $40, the liners are almost always on sale at CG. On longer rides (30+ minutes at highway speeds) the cold will start to creep in on 30 degree or less mornings but without heated gear that's pretty much unavoidable I think.
1978 Suzuki GS1000EC - Completely custom.
2012 Triumph Daytona 675R

Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2015, 11:11:57 pm »
Go ride man!

Rick, you're a nut!  :)  Perhaps you missed the part of my post about having to shovel snow off the driveway and walks?  Cold doesn't deter me but snow does. I've tried riding in snow...it doesn't work and you end up falling.  (And that's not even considering what the salt is doing to your bike!)



CHRIS
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Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2015, 02:29:14 pm »
By my way of thinking,

If i can get down my driveway, i can ride.

But if its bad enough to need a shovel, im calling in and going back to bed.

Got a dandy little "heater" there to keep my hands warm.  :what
What does "riding season" mean?

Offline Chris

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #20 on: November 25, 2015, 09:05:29 am »
By my way of thinking,

If i can get down my driveway, i can ride.

But if its bad enough to need a shovel, im calling in and going back to bed.

Got a dandy little "heater" there to keep my hands warm.  :what

And congrats on the heater.  :)

Monday was snowing and shoveling weather...Tuesday cleared and warmed up just enough to melt most of the snow...and today it started by sleeting.  Pretty crappy weather but at lease I don't have to shovel it.

Tuesday I did get the bike out for a quick run to the base to pick up a few things at the commissary.  I dressed pretty warm as the temps were in the mid 30s and I stayed plenty warm while riding.  However, I just about froze afterwards using the hose to wash the salt residue off the bike   Here's the video I took to prove I actually rode.  Note the whitish salt on the roadway.  It's a pretty short video at a little over 7 minutes.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pK2ojO7KeK0&feature=youtu.be
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 09:09:52 am by Chris »
CHRIS
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1978 GS1000C / 1979 GS1000S / 1981 CM400C / 1986 RG500 GAMMA / 1988 R100RS / 1991 K100RS / 1997 GSF1200 BANDIT

Offline gl1dinorider

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Re: Finally - A New Suzuki Gixxer 1000!
« Reply #21 on: November 25, 2015, 10:47:09 am »
Nice.

Been thinking about a ural patrol.

Two wheel drive for snow.

Just got to locate one i can make the right deal on.

May be may end up on a trike or side hack rig before im done anyway.

And from what ive read, urals require daily tinkering.

But i did see one with a vw dual port 60 hp motor on it.

So no retorqueing (sp?) the heads every couple hundred miles.

Have also seen a lot of cheap bmw bikes lately

Might be able to adapt the ural side drive unit and go hack with one of them.

Or. . . . . . . . .
What does "riding season" mean?